Comments on: Ashes to Ashes, Dust to Dust http://benbalbo.com/2008/06/18/ashes-to-ashes-dust-to-dust/ Programmer, Property Tycoon, Media Mogul Wed, 07 Jan 2009 00:27:04 +0000 http://wordpress.org/?v=2.6.3 By: Ben Balbo http://benbalbo.com/2008/06/18/ashes-to-ashes-dust-to-dust/#comment-32158 Ben Balbo Mon, 30 Jun 2008 02:46:12 +0000 http://benbalbo.com/?p=193#comment-32158 Hi Andy! Thanks for your comment. I have to say I disagree with what I assume are your two points: 1. Haunted feelings and cutting relationships clean: Cremation doesn't, in my opinion, cut relationships. You can still look out to sea where the ashes were scattered, or contemplate memories while looking at the urn in which they lie. Either way, feelings bear no relationship to the environmental effects. 2. Making land useless for agricultural purposes: I'm not sure how many farmers cultivate forested land. I would imagine those that do have additional problems to contend with such as lack of direct sunlight and difficulty in protecting crop from native animals. I appreciate your contribution, but I'm afraid I don't understand it. If I've misunderstood you, please let me know. Hi Andy! Thanks for your comment. I have to say I disagree with what I assume are your two points:

1. Haunted feelings and cutting relationships clean: Cremation doesn’t, in my opinion, cut relationships. You can still look out to sea where the ashes were scattered, or contemplate memories while looking at the urn in which they lie. Either way, feelings bear no relationship to the environmental effects.

2. Making land useless for agricultural purposes: I’m not sure how many farmers cultivate forested land. I would imagine those that do have additional problems to contend with such as lack of direct sunlight and difficulty in protecting crop from native animals.

I appreciate your contribution, but I’m afraid I don’t understand it. If I’ve misunderstood you, please let me know.

]]> By: Andy http://benbalbo.com/2008/06/18/ashes-to-ashes-dust-to-dust/#comment-32005 Andy Fri, 27 Jun 2008 14:20:26 +0000 http://benbalbo.com/?p=193#comment-32005 Atleast cremation does not block the land for centuries with haunted feelings and not usable for agriculture. Cremation does not leave any trail for people to remember their past and moan upon it cuts the relation clean and people have to move on. Atleast cremation does not block the land for centuries with haunted feelings and not usable for agriculture.
Cremation does not leave any trail for people to remember their past and moan upon it cuts the relation clean and people have to move on.

]]> By: J http://benbalbo.com/2008/06/18/ashes-to-ashes-dust-to-dust/#comment-31529 J Thu, 19 Jun 2008 11:13:18 +0000 http://benbalbo.com/?p=193#comment-31529 Just came across this (should really be in a meeting now, but they're late :P) http://publications.environment-agency.gov.uk/pdf/SCHO0404BGLA-e-e.pdf which gives the main risk factor as the height of the water table. Presumably if you bury high enough in the ground, and the water table under usual circumstances is low down enough, even in high-saturation conditions, the body shouldn't contaminate the water... Not had time to read the whole thing. Interesting, though ;o) Just came across this (should really be in a meeting now, but they’re late :P) http://publications.environment-agency.gov.uk/pdf/SCHO0404BGLA-e-e.pdf

which gives the main risk factor as the height of the water table. Presumably if you bury high enough in the ground, and the water table under usual circumstances is low down enough, even in high-saturation conditions, the body shouldn’t contaminate the water…

Not had time to read the whole thing. Interesting, though ;o)

]]> By: Tassja http://benbalbo.com/2008/06/18/ashes-to-ashes-dust-to-dust/#comment-31523 Tassja Thu, 19 Jun 2008 08:55:48 +0000 http://benbalbo.com/?p=193#comment-31523 I remember reading a science journal years ago about how the pollution of ground water by bacteria in decomposing bodies (not embalmed) got into the ground water and then into the wells (yup some people in the uk still have wells). As a result people who drank the water got sick and some children died. I remember being really shocked by the fact that the dead really can hurt you. I'll have a dig around and see if I can find the report on it. I remember reading a science journal years ago about how the pollution of ground water by bacteria in decomposing bodies (not embalmed) got into the ground water and then into the wells (yup some people in the uk still have wells). As a result people who drank the water got sick and some children died. I remember being really shocked by the fact that the dead really can hurt you.

I’ll have a dig around and see if I can find the report on it.

]]> By: Ben Balbo http://benbalbo.com/2008/06/18/ashes-to-ashes-dust-to-dust/#comment-31518 Ben Balbo Thu, 19 Jun 2008 07:55:14 +0000 http://benbalbo.com/?p=193#comment-31518 Hiya! I just had a read of the BBC page, and it seems the freeze-drying process is an alternative to embalming, and that the embalming fluid is the toxin. I've also done a little searching for other toxins that bodies release after burial, and most results again just point to embalming fluid. If that's the case, I'd still opt for a natural burial, no embalming fluid, and no need to waste liquid nitrogen. Of course my research is nothing close to comprehensive. I'll keep looking ;-) Hiya! I just had a read of the BBC page, and it seems the freeze-drying process is an alternative to embalming, and that the embalming fluid is the toxin. I’ve also done a little searching for other toxins that bodies release after burial, and most results again just point to embalming fluid.

If that’s the case, I’d still opt for a natural burial, no embalming fluid, and no need to waste liquid nitrogen. Of course my research is nothing close to comprehensive. I’ll keep looking ;-)

]]> By: Tassja http://benbalbo.com/2008/06/18/ashes-to-ashes-dust-to-dust/#comment-31517 Tassja Thu, 19 Jun 2008 07:48:30 +0000 http://benbalbo.com/?p=193#comment-31517 Hiya Ben :o) There was a news article on the bbc site which I saw back in 2004, I'm very interested in the method described there. Might solve the problem with the toxins released from the body. http://news.bbc.co.uk/1/hi/world/europe/3473103.stm As for pics of Nathan, we do have loads of them, I've just not updated the wisemantribe gallery or flickr in a while. Though I will upload some more to flickr today :o) Hiya Ben :o)

There was a news article on the bbc site which I saw back in 2004, I’m very interested in the method described there. Might solve the problem with the toxins released from the body. http://news.bbc.co.uk/1/hi/world/europe/3473103.stm

As for pics of Nathan, we do have loads of them, I’ve just not updated the wisemantribe gallery or flickr in a while. Though I will upload some more to flickr today :o)

]]> By: Ben Balbo http://benbalbo.com/2008/06/18/ashes-to-ashes-dust-to-dust/#comment-31474 Ben Balbo Wed, 18 Jun 2008 15:23:28 +0000 http://benbalbo.com/?p=193#comment-31474 Hi T, J & N! That's a very good point - I hadn't thought of that... I'll see if I can find out any more info. P.S. I haven't seen any pics of Nathan for a few moths - any updates? Hi T, J & N! That’s a very good point - I hadn’t thought of that… I’ll see if I can find out any more info.

P.S. I haven’t seen any pics of Nathan for a few moths - any updates?

]]> By: J http://benbalbo.com/2008/06/18/ashes-to-ashes-dust-to-dust/#comment-31437 J Wed, 18 Jun 2008 10:43:55 +0000 http://benbalbo.com/?p=193#comment-31437 Tassja and I have discussed this at length, and our point of wondering is in how ecologically friendly our bodies are when they decompose. I know with some burial sites, groundwater has been contaminated due to the toxins released by bodies due to what people consume and what the body stores along the way. I'd love to see the point resolved, because if the human body is inherently toxic, I'm not sure there's an ecologically sound way of disposing of it. Perhaps we just have to accept that there's always going to be some kind of trade-off? (As an aside, there are quite a few woodland burial sites springing up in the UK now. I'm very interested to see how this thread pans out). Tassja and I have discussed this at length, and our point of wondering is in how ecologically friendly our bodies are when they decompose. I know with some burial sites, groundwater has been contaminated due to the toxins released by bodies due to what people consume and what the body stores along the way.

I’d love to see the point resolved, because if the human body is inherently toxic, I’m not sure there’s an ecologically sound way of disposing of it. Perhaps we just have to accept that there’s always going to be some kind of trade-off?

(As an aside, there are quite a few woodland burial sites springing up in the UK now. I’m very interested to see how this thread pans out).

]]> By: his other half http://benbalbo.com/2008/06/18/ashes-to-ashes-dust-to-dust/#comment-31428 his other half Wed, 18 Jun 2008 07:36:51 +0000 http://benbalbo.com/?p=193#comment-31428 Wikipedia has an entry for it: http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Eco-cemetery For more, search google for: natural burial then search for: natural burials Lots of very inspiring ideas. First time I heard about this was in a book called: "Go Mad! 365 Daily Ways To Save The Planet". A little gem of a book if you live in the UK :) And last I heard was when I received the Permablitz newsletter about the site in New Zealand :) http://www.permablitz.net/ Wikipedia has an entry for it: http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Eco-cemetery

For more, search google for: natural burial
then search for: natural burials
Lots of very inspiring ideas.

First time I heard about this was in a book called: “Go Mad! 365 Daily Ways To Save The Planet”. A little gem of a book if you live in the UK :) And last I heard was when I received the Permablitz newsletter about the site in New Zealand :) http://www.permablitz.net/

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